mocha crash

I can t open mocha hitfilm that give me this error message:

Warning: Cannot connect to the MediaIOserver; QuickTime will not be available.

know that I had already installed  Quickime so ,I don't know what happen to me I need your help please!

Comments

  • Hi @HitFilmer122621

    With this issue Imagineer Systems might be better placed to help you. I've done some quick research and it looks like this is a problem they've seen before: https://www.imagineersystems.com/forums/topic/problem-with-mocha-hitfilm/

    I'd suggest you try out the fixes their support people mention in that thread, and if that doesn't fix your problem, start a thread over on their forums.

    Hope you get it sorted.

  • Hey @DanielGWood,

    I get it - it's their software.  However this is your product and HitFilm provides zero assistance on software requirements for installation of your flagship product.  I own both HitFilm 4 Pro and HitFilm Pro 2017.  When installing Pro 2017 on a clean Windows 10 LTSB installation Mocha fails miserably.  Sure, I could go troll Mocha's forums but, hey, novel idea why doesn't HitFilm Staff get together with Imagineer Staff and figure out the requirements for your integration of their software instead of pointing the finger for your users to go over their and get someone who knows little to nothing about your integration of their software?  That would be amazing and probably something you should just do, because as you can see it's going to keep coming up over and over again until 1) you provide guidance or 2) you fix it so it's not a problem when installing your product.

    If you don't want to fix it I'll just keep opening tickets with you as a paid customer.  I love the product, but c'mon.  The "thats-not-my-job" approach is just crappy customer service and very much not appreciated after dropping hundreds of dollars to help spearhead HitFilm moving forward.  I didn't have to buy 2017 - but I want to see the product continue to do well and I love what you get compared to the Adobe-subscription-ridiculousness of the world.

    Please don't stoop to their levels.  Own it and exceed the customer's expectation.

  • @windexh8er I know it can be frustrating but this problem is not a question of integration and really is strictly an Imagineer issue. Problems with Mocha's MediaIOServer occur on both Mac and Windows across multiple hosts. Fxhome can't do anything to fix MediaIOServer problems because it's not their product, it's not their code and they don't have access to it to fix it even if they knew exactly what to do. 

  • edited January 2017

    @Aladdin4d

    I think you're missing the point.  You bundle it and sell it as one.  That means you provide guidance on system requirements (Do you install Mocha separate?  No.).  I agree, if Mocha is failing that is Imagineer's problem.   But you're conflating two problems: 1) installation requirements - which are what I'm asking you for and which you should provide customers and 2) a bug within Imagineer software - which is not the problem here.  It is obvious the problem is a dependency that is missing and something that FXHome and Imagineer should be able to talk to each other and provide guidance to FXHome customers since, one more time, FXHome sells it bundled as one.

    Also, I bought the product from FXHome, not Imagineer.  I get it, you bundled a component, but the installation is all on FXHome along with the severe lack of guidance.  What I am asking for is still the same from my original request and I will continue to push the question until FXHome addresses it.  I am a paying customer and that is part of what FXHome needs to provide.

    However, I have cross posted this problem in the Imagineer forums and asked for guidance.  Something FXHome should be doing.

    https://www.imagineersystems.com/forums/topic/problem-with-mocha-hitfilm/

  • Triem23Triem23 Moderator

    Some notes:

    First: FxHome does talk to and work with Imagineer--but direct contact from users to Imagineer helps. Squeaky wheels get greased.

    Second: You assume FxHome hasn't looked at the code at their end? As noted, this is an issue in mocha across several hosts. FxHome can do nothing in this case. When the MedialOserver error exists across multiple hosts, across multiple platforms, and the other half of the error is Quicktime, it's "obvious" the error is not FxHome code. It's not an integration with Hitfilm issue when the same error happens in Ae, Avid, etc. That's "obvious." Honestly, it's probably Apple code since QT is aged, 32-bit only code that hasn't been updated or patched since 2011. Hitfilm, Mocha, Vegas, FCP, Avid, all of these have QT issues, because QT is not up to modern standards.

    Incidentally, I specifically bring up Ae and Quicktime because Hitfilm, Fusion and Nuke interface with mocha via the OFX framework. Ae and other hosts use a custom integration framework. Since this issue is common across all hosts it's  "obvious" that the issue is either Imagineer code or Apple code, as the other option is the manufacturers of every mocha compatible host screwed up their integration code in such a way as to cause the identical error. 

    Unfortunately camera manufacturers continue to perpetuate the issue by continuing to use mov wrappers, perpetuating issues resulting from having to use an obsolete, orphaned framework. The reality is, as a paying customer, you can continue to open support tickets with FxHome, and their answer will continue to be "talk to Imagineer," because it's "obvious" that FxHome cannot make changes to Imagineer's proprietary, patented, copywritten, privately owned code. 

    Third: for reference, Moderators are not FxHome Staff, just users who have limited forum access to kill the occasional spam posts. Aladdin and I will assume all "you bundle" comments are for @DanielGWood (Danny boy, to quote Arnold Rimmer, "'Mind that bus.' 'What bus?' Splat.")

    Fourth: installation requirements are already provided by FxHome: https://hitfilm.com/express/specs The information is provided via a hotlink at the bottom of the features screens (which links to the page linked above. Express and Pro have identical requirements. However, I will tag @CedricBonnier to consider adding a bigger, bluer button next to "Buy, Upgrade, Trial" to make these requirements easier for customers to find. 

    Fifth: Mocha's requirements are actually less than Hitfilm's, therefore, listing them, while nice, would be redundant.

    Should FxHome also list system requirements for NewBlue, Magic Bullet and iClone? Admittedly, not a bad idea as Magic Bullet and iClone have higher minimal requirements than Hitfilm, but finding that information took typing ">program name< specs into a search engine, then clicking the top result. 

    Sixth: As long as Cedric is tagged, if FxHome wishes to consider adding the mocha and BCC requirements to the specs page, here they are for an easy cut/paste. 

    All Boris says is:

    Graphics Cards: We recommend that you run the latest graphics card driver version supported by your host application. A graphics card with a minimum of 512MB of RAM is suggested; 1GB of RAM is recommended.

    Product Version: mocha Pro 5
    Software Requirement:

    Mac: Mac OS X 10.7 or higher on Intel 

    Windows: Windows 8, Windows 7, Windows XP Professional SP2 or higher, Windows Vista Business or Ultimate, on x64.

    Linux: Red Hat Enterprise Linux 5, CentOS 5 or a compatible Linux distribution on x86_64.

    Hardware:

    Recommended Hardware Processor: Intel Core 2 Duo or equivalent

    Memory: 4 GB + Disk: High-speed disk array Graphics Card: NVDIA Quadro FX 1500 or equivalentMonitor: 1920×1080 or higherNetwork: Must have an enabled network adapter (wifi or ethernet)

    Minimal Requirements: Processor: At least 1-GHz Pentium IV Disk: At least 1 GBMemory: At least 1 GBGraphics card: Must support OpenGL Monitor: Minimum resolution 1200×800 pixelsNetwork: Must have an enabled network adapter (wifi or ethernet)

  • edited January 2017

    Wow, quite the arrogant response, clearly you didn't read mine @Triem23.

    For starters...

    "First" - Then why does FXHome point the finger right to Imagineer without actually addressing the problem that is, as I said a few times, not with the software - BUT WITH THE DEPENDENCIES.  If it's truly just C++ redistributables those can be bundled with an installer.

    "Second" - Again, you apparently didn't read.  I am not saying it's even a code issue.  I simply  stated that FXHome and Imagineer should likely get together if FXHome is packaging their software AND NOT PROVIDING THE CORRECT DEPENDENCIES DURING AN INSTALLATION.  This is very common practice in the software space @Triem23, not rocket science my friend.

    "Third" - If you're going to respond to an end user and present yourself by making statements like "Fxhome can't do anything to fix..." then you should clarify your position with FXHome.  Are you speaking for them or just as a matter of fact?  Maybe that's clear to you - a superior being with moderator privileges.  But I'm unaware if moderators are FXHome staff or not.  Sorry, I don't spend as much time here as you, clearly.

    "Fourth" - Again, you didn't even care to read or comprehend my ask.  My ask is for FXHome to provide all software requirements in addition to hardware.  Thank you again for copying and pasting something I've looked at.  Please point me to all of the software that is required beyond the HitFilm installer.  Oh, right.  There isn't any...  When you bundle a product that has other companies software you assume the duty of filling in the blanks of things like external dependencies.  You have to assume your end user is installing on a clean system with no other software.  In that regard, and in this case HitFilm does not make that assumption and falls short on what is included.  Out of the box - it does not work correctly.  Imagine if other things in your life worked like that.  "Well sir, you bought a Toyota, but that part - yeah, it's made by some other manufacturer.  So, you'll have to go to them to get it fixed."  And as I said - I understand the why behind it.  But, that doesn't make the user experience any better @Triem23.

    So, thanks for not reading pretty much anything I was trying to convene.  And if anything, based on your response alone, I'm not sure I'll ever purchase another FXHome product.  So good job being a not-so-good bastion of help in these forums.  Next time try to understand the ask before resorting to a whole lot of wasted typing...  Just sayin', it might save you some time.

  • @windexh8er According to the documentation supplied with the Mocha plugin by Imagineer there aren't any required external dependencies. What then should be included?

    The vast majority of users are not encountering the same problem implying any and all requirements are being met by and/or for the aforementioned majority. Because of your post I have tried installing Pro 2017 on three different systems running Win 7, Win 8, and Win 10 respectively. All are 'clean' Windows installations fully updated as of 1/10/2017 with Office 2016, Paragon HFS+. 7 Zip and QuickTime being the only additional installed programs. The Mocha plugin started without error on all three systems. What then should be included that isn't already?

    MediaIOServer is developed by Imagineer for Mocha. Its purpose has to do with interfacing with the QuickTime framework. Does installing QuickTime fix the problem? Is any dependency really a QuickTime dependency? Neither Fxhome or Imagineer bundle QuickTime so what then should be included that isn't already?

    Since MediaIOServer is an Imagineer product and only Imagineer knows its peculiarities it's up to Imagineer to supply the information on any potential dependencies.

  • Triem23Triem23 Moderator

    @Windexh8er arrogance? Nice to meet you, Pot, I'm Kettle. We shall bold at each other. Possibly more italics.  

    Software dependencies. I'll cheerfully admit I misunderstood. However, many users have overlooked system requirements (this forum has at least one person a week whose issue is sub-par system.) and tagging a staff member and suggesting making that particular information easier to find is am attempt to help others.

    Aladdin also seems to have misunderstood you, and he's more of a techie than I. Perhaps, just maybe, your initial comments were poorly phrased. 

    Out of boredom (as I spend my workday riding a single audio fader), just for fun, I decided to look up software dependencies for many programs. Adobe, Boris, Imagineer, Mozilla, On-One, Blackmagic, Lightwave, Avid, Autodesk... None of them list software dependencies on their sites. Obviously I'm biased towards multimedia packages today, but dependencies don't  seem to be commonly listed by, well, anyone's website. Hitfilm's info screen lists used libraries, but the flip side to that is to read that screen the software must be installed already. 

    Note that it's often thought that Mods are Staff. I'm the guy who remembers to say we're not. For more clarification, similar issues have come up with mocha before, as well as Vegas integration, and BCC. My response parrots comments made by Staff--FWIW being able to accurately repeat official answers is part of why those who are Moderators were asked to do so. If FxHome has not given a previous answer a Mod would simply say "you'll need to ask Staff" and link to support. On a related note, pasting in the listed mocha requirements really was for Staff. If a staff member reads this thread and decides "Yes, let's list the add-on's requirements," then Staff doesn't have to look it up. Really am trying to help. 

    MedialOserver is the Imagineer code to interface with Quicktime. So this time, when I say FxHome can't do anything, that's objective fact. Again I posit the issue here is Apple's crap QT code, and the sooner that framework dies, the better for all. Sorry it makes the user experience worse.

    Interesting you used a car analogy. See, my last car came with a third party alarm. I purchased said car new from the dealer. There was an issue with the alarm. The dealer referred me to the alarm's manufacturer. That's who I ended up dealing with. Go figure!

    Customer service, like life, is imperfect. Continuing to address this issue with Mocha will still be more productive than addressing FxHome, since I fail to see what FxHome can do about an issue between Mocha code and Quicktime.

    If you choose to not remain an FxHome customer because of me,  that's a shame. It's solid product. Adobe has great software, but the annoying subscription model. Boris Red is a solid layer based compositor. Fusion and Nuke are wonderful Node based systems, Except for Red, all can host mocha. 

  • @windexh8er

    Good morning,

    First - apologies for the delayed response, I'm not in the office over the weekend.

    My original reply to HitFilmer122621 wasn't intended as passing the buck to mocha, or “thats-not-my-job”, rather that mocha's support staff already seemed to be aware of the problem, and had a number of solutions written out on that page. So, the fastest route to the customer getting their problem solved seemed to be that way. That is the priority for me usually.

    I’m assuming that you are/were experiencing the same error as that user?

    I was not aware of a problem with installing mocha HitFilm, but I will ask that somebody has a look into that. I would note that in some prior cases, a pre-existing corrupt/incompatible version of the C++ redistributables has prevented HitFilm from using its own (mocha may be susceptible to this too), so it is unlikely to be something we can prevent from ever happening. Still, if we can reduce it, we will. Thank-you for bringing it up.

    As you rightly point out, expecting users to install the C++ redistributables (or any other dependencies which the installer ought to handle) themselves before installing our software would be a bit nuts; for that reason mentioning backend software dependencies on the requirements page isn’t something we’d do - it would create more confusion than benefit.

    Concerning the hardware requirements, as far as I was aware mocha’s were lower than HitFilm’s, but perhaps we can make that clearer on the Store page (incidentally @Triem23 the requirements for Pro are listed on the Store page https://hitfilm.com/store/hitfilm-pro-2017 as well as in Support). It’s a good point that we don’t mention those of third-party software at all.

    As I said I will pass the issue on to our software team to look into, and let you know what they come back with.

  • @windexh8er

    I've spoken to our Lead Software Developer, and he's looked into what mocha HitFilm requires (in terms of software dependencies) and how it is installed.

    MediaIOServer.exe (the mocha component) requires an older version of the Visual Studio runtime than HitFilm Pro 2017, however we actually do install that older version too, so that shouldn't be a problem. This probably explains why it works in the majority of cases.

    Our working theory is that in your case, you had an incompatible version of the VS runtime already on your system. In a similar issue we had before, a customer had the 32-bit version of the runtime installed, which was blocking the 64-bit version. As these are installed into a shared location, it can happen from time to time.

    I'm going to contact you via our Support system to see if we can get this fixed, then once we have some concrete steps for people to follow, we will post the solution here.

  • @windexh8er just to clarify, we do talk to Imagineer on a regular basis and exchange bug reports and temporary workarounds when waiting for a bug fix.

    Unfortunately, the fact that two different companies are involved means that sometimes you have to wait for a fix to get to you. I'm not throwing the stone at anyone here but sometimes they are busy with other stuff, sometimes we are and haven't got time to integrate a build they send us until a few days later but we try our best to keep everyone happy.

    On a more important note, have you solved your mocha issue? As you said it is bundled with HitFilm and should work. Please feel free to post on here or send us a support ticket until we can make it work as expected for you.

    @Triem23 FYI I don't do any website stuff, you can tag the intelligent people like @DanielGWood for that kind of things :p

  • Triem23Triem23 Moderator

    @CedricBonnier @DanielGWood, thank you for the clarifications. I'll make notes to remember this if it comes up again. 

  • @DanielGWood
    I had no versions of VS runtimes on my  machine.  While buried in banter I did state it was a clean installation of W10 LTSB (which may not come with something that is assumed included in Anniversary edition, I'm still trying to understand if that is a truth or not).  So out of the box something is missing there.  Based on what is include in HF17 my first guess was an incorrect version was included based on some of the cryptic comments on the Imagineer boards.

    Re: external deps - agreed.  My point was simply if there is something that is not bundled it should be and I appreciate your statement publicly so your mods can better understand that.

    I will reinstall the 2k8 64 bit directly and see if that helps.  One other thing I was going to test was the BitDefender angle, some people have stated that was breaking MediaIOServer.  Unfortunately if that is the case it's something Imagineer didn't provide guidance on for the installer of HF17 (exception, etc).

    My intent was to solve the problem and post back since I felt like I was talking to the wall yesterday.  Thank you for opening the ticket, as I have time I'll communicate via that conduit.  Hopefully I can do some digging this afternoon.

    Thanks again @DanielGWood and @CedricBonnier.

    Oh and - no I still get the error.  Although with 2010 C++ redistributable Mocha now works (since I couldn't find a reference to what version was actually required I started there).  However, I don't know if it's working correctly given I still get an error upon dropping into the workflow.

  • Thanks for getting back to us, it's interesting that it didn't work as expected on a vanilla Windows 10 install.

    Look forward to hearing from you in the ticket, hopefully we can sort this out quickly!

  • I installed a new update for Hitfilm 2017 (PC version) and this MediaIOServer error came up during or after installation.

    Installing Quicktime 7.7.9 stops the error coming up when running Hitfilm but I don't think it's right. If I right click on a media file I don't get the option to open in Mocha.

    But I can right click, go to New Effect and add a Mocha Hitfilm effect. Then I have the option to Launch Mocha UI and open it that way. It seems to be working but it's not how it normally works. 

  • Sorry to respond an old thread. I have encounter a quite similar problem. I'm using HF 2017 express, bought mocha as "plugin". My machine is ASUS X555QG w/R7&R8. I have successfully install and run Mocha Pro V5 standalone LE. But fails everytime I tried to launch mocha UI inside HF 2017 express. I've opened a ticket and get some reponse, but the problem still persist. Is there any chance other users managed to solve problem similar to this?

     

  • @SunuPradana Mocha Pro standalone does not open as a plug in for ANY program. The only version that can work as a plug-in inside Express is the Mocha Hitfilm available in the Hitfilm Store.

    The Mocha Pro PLUG IN version can open in Hitfilm Pro (I don't think it works with Express). 

    The Mocha Pro STANDALONE is an exterior program that, well, runs on its own, not as a plug-in. This is why Imagineer sells multiple versions. You're not encountering a bug or error, as such, just running into how different versions work. 

    From Mocha Pro you'll have to use Mocha's Export Menu to export Hitfilm Composite Shots of any camera solves, roto splines or corner pin tracks then import into Hitfilm using the Import Composite Shot function. 

    Anything you do in Mocha Pro's Insert, Remove, Stabilize or Lens Correction modules will have to be rendered from Mocha itself as image sequence or video and reimported into Hitfilm.

    I suggest contacting Imagineer support directly and adding a new question to the Hitfilm support ticket if the Mocha Pro plug in version works in Express (I don't think it does, but I can be wrong). If so, ask Imagineer if you can shift your license from standalone to plug-in.

    This week between Xmas and New Year's might be slow response. Lots of people on vacation. 

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